Not a disease, a learning disorder

Maia Salavitz has written the definitive piece on addiction. In convincing fashion, she demolishes the the old-guard dogma and injects some common sense into the debate. This is the kind of fearless writing we need to counter step-speak and speculative "science."
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Most of Us Still Don’t Get It: Addiction Is a Learning Disorder

The AA Voice is Loud--Merci to OPF

Alright. So I feel like I am being an attention getter on here, as this is my 2nd blog post of this month. Yikes and sorry for whatever creepy narcissism I am potentially spewing onto the OPF. Some of you know I started going back a little--and then a lot--and then a little, etc. I initially felt like I was being smart. I even read (I ithnk on here?) a meetings survival guideline. It was addressed to ppl. something like this, "If youre gonna go, then make sure you do this that and this, too." It helped. Plus I've been out before for like a full year. Blah blah blah.

Orange Papers Greatest Hits!

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whats your favorite hits (excerpt) from orange papers ......?
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or any wonderfulness you have experienced along the way

AA destroying self-source energy

Just got a call from steptard I thought had left my life.
seems he wanted INFO/SEEKING SECRETS
AA-MC CORMICK HOSPITAL CLOSED/HOORAY
Muzzy wanted to see if I could be blamed.
just called to find out if I was reason they got
THROWN OUT.WHOO HOO WHOOIPIE
When realized I could give damn about them
gotta go call u later/like when Hell Freezes Over.
Idiots.said i'm not suprised,you're out.Explained
that's a $3million property U R on.
Now here's a Christian Hospital /all remodeled
new E-R .new wings,but AA=shithole,slum.

The Fix.com has " hidden" the comments section : why?

Criticisms about aa hurts vunerable newcomers - by knowing the truth?
0% (0 votes)
Majority clean wo aa have no message & don't help - rehab recruitments?
0% (0 votes)
The AA sucess story depends on The Priciple of Anonimity - not knowing and hiding?
0% (0 votes)
Advertiser recruitment quotas go up as aa info goes down?
0% (0 votes)
The Fix.com suppresses aa inefficacy to profit - from weak newcomers?
0% (0 votes)
Fuck it - 95% leave AA anyhow?
0% (0 votes)
Matters bc 30 B /yr is wasted that could provide better alt help.
0% (0 votes)
Rhetorical Polls are better - voting results will be hidden.
0% (0 votes)
Total votes: 0

Stepper Cult Joke

What does a packet of cigarettes and the stepper cult have in common?

BOTH ought to have a government health warning attached to them

Thoreau on Pyramid Schemes (like AA)

"As for the Pyramids, there is nothing to wonder at in them so much as the fact that so many men could be found degraded enough to spend their lives constructing a tomb for some ambitious booby...

"...For my part, I should like to know who in those days did not build them — who were above such trifling." -Henry David Thoreau

If you went to Rehab for Drugs or Alcohol, what movies did the Rehab show you?

Days of Wines and Roses - Starring Jack Lemmon and Lee Remick
0% (0 votes)
Clean and Sober - Starring Michael Keaton
0% (0 votes)
When a Man Loves a Woman - Starring Andy Garcia and Meg Ryan
0% (0 votes)
The Lost Weekend - Starring Ray Milland and Jane Wyman
0% (0 votes)
My name Is Bill W. (1989) - Starring James Woods
10% (1 vote)
28 Days - Starring Sandra Bullock
10% (1 vote)
A combination of all of the above - please specify
20% (2 votes)
They didn't show any of the movies
10% (1 vote)
Other- please specify
50% (5 votes)
Total votes: 10

Truly Intelligent Religion-Mongers Can’t Prove That There Is No Flying Spaghetti Monster!

jimbattle---If you’d ever taken a college-level course in logic, you’d know that it’s impossible to logically prove a negative. I said it once a day or two ago and I’ll say it again now---GO BACK TO SCHOOL!

Who knows? If you did, you might even learn a thing or two---like how to correctly spell “Beatles” and grasping the concept that it’s impossible to logically prove a negative...for openers... although, I suppose you’ll probably just stay stuck in the anti-intellectual tarpit of your simplistic (if not retarded), sorry excuse for what you call “religion.”

Truly Intelligent Atheists Admit that You Can’t Prove that There Is No God. So Soberman Is Wrong and Here’s the Proof.

Soberman has been proven wrong by atheists who are much more intelligent than he is and (in this case) much more honest. What one of these atheists pointed out in the first 10 minutes of the video below proves that Soberman is being dishonest by pretending that he has proven to members of this forum that God does not exist.

Friends/Buddies from the Rooms

Recently, I have noticed a member or two on this forum seem confused about me keeping my connections to ppl. in the rooms. I still go on occassion out of loyalty. Admittedly, a very small part of my compulsion to return to the rooms is out of a kind of fucked up superstition or something. But mostly it is b/c I have known many of these people for my whole entire adult life (I am 40). On OPF and other anti 12 step Internet blogs, I have noticed and been active in the discussion regarding how ppl. in the rooms treat us weirdly when we stop going.

OPF Joke

Q--- What do Penn and Teller, Monty Python’s Flying Circus and Jimbattle all have in common?

A--- Spot the Looney!

ALL RECOVERY & TREATMENT PROGRAMS ARE RELIGIOUS, INCLUDING THE "SECULAR" PROGRAMS THAT ARE PROMOTED ON THIS FORUM

If you can't open this post to read more, you can go to my blog and read it. The link below will take you there:

Blog: http://orangepapersforumandreligion.blogspot.com/

Watch the following 4-minute video BEFORE you read the rest of this post. Then I will make it very clear how what the speaker said relates to my statement about all treatment and recovery programs. Below is the link to this video titled "Is Secular Humanism a religion or just a worldview?"

Stepper Cult Joke

What has Penn & Teller and Monty Pythons Flying Circus got in common?

Spot the Looney !

IMPORTANT!!! First read below! - The Scientific Case for the Existence of God! (What Some OPF Members Don't Want You to Know)

A few months ago, I noticed that some OPF members were doing something very strange. The reason that I am not going to tell you about it on this blog is because, from time to time, someone uses their internet skills to make it impossible open the comments and read them. Realizing they might do the same thing to THIS post, I have place it on another blog. The link below will take you there:

New Blog: http://orangepapersforumandreligion.blogspot.com/

94% of alcoholics recover from alcoholism without AA

It's already been well established that 75% of of those who recover from alcohol dependence (alcoholism) do so without any help: rehab, a hospital stay, a doctors visit or attending AA. [http://www.spectrum.niaaa.nih.gov/archives/v1i1Sept2009/features/alcohol... But how many recover from alcohol dependence without AA?

IMPORTANT!!! First read below! - To Hell and Back!

Watch the short video stories of two former atheists who believe they died and went to Hell. Both of these men are doctors with PhDs. One is an "alcoholic" physician who partied with famous people like Ringo Starr of The Beetles and Hoyt Axton. Clink this link to watch "To Hell and Back" - http://the-gospel-made-plain.blogspot.com/ BTW: Things are going great with exposing AA!

The Anonymous People Official Trailer (2014) about the 23.5 Million Americans in Long Term Recovery - Do you think that the numbers may be a little inflated?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6hyy1NnyQl8

The Anonymous People 2014

THE ANONYMOUS PEOPLE is a feature documentary film about the 23.5 million Americans living in long-term recovery from alcohol and other drug addiction.

Starring: Kristen Johnston, Chris herren
Runtime: 1 hour 28 minutes

PRACTISE MAKES PERFECT/HAPPY??

one karate master said=Karate is like pushing
a rock up a hill.If you stop practising-it falls back down."
what makes great musicians/Practise.Stop practising
for days -you will know difference.stop for weeks
and audience will know.
Do you tell yourself over and voer I'm helpless
I can't do this.We all need help.food -i don't grow
my own food.I don't raise beef/want to but not yet
keep listening to AAers and you'll come to BELIEVE THEM
keep with others saying you can do this .you have abillities

Stepper cult Joke

Bill Wilson dies and arrives at the 'Pearly Gates.' Saint Peter says to him 'who are you and what do you want?' 'I'm Bill Wilson, co-fonder of totally irreproachable AA, that has saved the lives and sanity of millions blah! blah! blah! and I want to come into Heaven.' 'Hold on.' say's Saint Peter 'I'll just go and see God about this.'

Did Dr Bob talk about God, resentments and character defects before or after he hit his daughter with that paddle?

Before he hit his daughter with that paddle
0% (0 votes)
After he hit his daughter with that paddle
0% (0 votes)
Dont know, but he allegedly hit his daughter with a paddle
100% (1 vote)
Total votes: 1

Did Bill Wilson talk about God, resentments and character defects before or after he preyed on female stepper cult victims?

Before he preyed on vulnerable female stepper cult victims
0% (0 votes)
After he preyed on vulnerable female stepper cult victims
0% (0 votes)
Don't know, but he was a prolific sexual predator whenever he preyed on his female victims
100% (1 vote)
Total votes: 1

‘That 70s Show’ Star Lisa Robin Kelly’s Family Suing Rehab Center For Wrongful Death - PAX House, Califorina - June 2014

‘That 70s Show’ Star Lisa Robin Kelly’s Family Suing Rehab Center For Wrongful Death

Posted on Jun 10, 2014 @ 7:32AM

Nearly one year after the tragic death of That 70s Show star Lisa Robin Kelly, RadarOnline.com has exclusively learned the actress’ family has filed a wrongful death lawsuit against the rehab center she was enrolled in at the time of her death.

The Bucket of Crabs, or Why AA and Alanon Are Bad For Your Health

The Bucket of Crabs, or Why AA and Alanon Are Bad For Your Health

Posted on May 12, 2010 by Dr. Mary Ellen Barnes & Dr. Ed Wilson

The “Bucket of Crabs” is one of our favorite analogies. Pulling crabs out of traps on Kodiak Island, we’d just toss them into a big bucket – no need to put a lid on the bucket.

Why not?

Because as soon as one crab would start to climb out, the other crabs would drag him, or her, right back down into the bottom of the bucket. There’s no escape to life back in the ocean.

Email to My Husband

As I am coming to terms with your involvement with Alcoholics Anonymous and setting out on my own 12-Step journey I feel that it is important that you understand something. I will never believe that you are an “alcoholic” or a “junkie.” I do not believe in the disease model. I will never believe that your issues with substance abuse define you or me or our family in any important way.

Again out of curiosity............

has anyone who attends or attended the stepper cult ever 'moderated' or returned to fairly responsible drinking due to working (?) those 12 steps? Which incidentally don't mention any 'abstinence' from alcohol whatsoever.

Or does this God, who can also be a fish bowl or Ford Escort or something equally nonsensical, just miracle everybody to stop drinking.......provided you attended AA meetings and work the 12 steps and blah! bah! blah!

The Stepper Cult – An irreproachable Self- Help Organisation that has saved the lives and sanity of millions of substance misusers

……or a lying fear-mongering 1930’s predatory and coercive cult that has ruined the lives and driven millions of substance abusers insane? And driven many many others to suicide.

What is the OPF best used as?

A method of stepper cult deprogramming
0% (0 votes)
A mehtod of exposing the lying, fear-mongering, predatory, coersive cult of steppism
0% (0 votes)
Both of the above
50% (1 vote)
A means to slag off any Anti Stepper that does not belive as you do nor post as you wish
50% (1 vote)
Total votes: 2

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