Randolph Pozdol in Miami Florida gets 30 yr sentence for pornographic filming and sex with his AA Sponcees Children aged 4 & 6, July 23, 2012

JR Harris's picture
Submitted by JR Harris on Mon, 07/23/2012 - 21:16

This is totally disgusting, any AA apologetic members that try to say this doesn't happen in the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous are just as disgusting. I can say a lot about this, but this is just sick and has publicly happened more than once. Get rid of this confession cult, that is all that I can say...

Miami Man Gets 30 Years For Child Porn and Sexual Assault Charges

Randolph Pozdol, 68, told a federal court judge he suffered from sex addiction
By Karen Franklin Monday, Jul 23, 2012

A Miami man who was arrested for sexually assaulting two Dania Beach children and downloading child porn was sentenced to 30 years in prison, the South Florida Sun Sentinel reported.

Randolph Pozdol, 68, who admitted to the assaults, told a federal court judge he suffered from sex addiction but that the assault on the children was a one-time aberration, the newspaper said.

"A period of madness is why I'm here today," he was quoted as saying.

Pozdol was originally arrested when downloads of child porn were traced to his home. Investigators found more than 175 illegal images and videos as well as the video of the sexual assault of the children, who appeared to have been drugged.

Click here to read about a Plantation man found guilty of child porn charges.

The assaults of the children, now 14 and 12 years old, happened over a two-and-a-half-year period between 2004 and 2006. Their mother, whom Pozdol sponsored in Alcoholics Anonymous and was romantically involved with, died of an accidental drug overdose in 2006 after taking morphine and an antidepressant, according to investigators.

The woman’s brother and sister, who adopted the two children, said in court that they were relieved Pozdol would not harm again, the Sentinel reported.

Source: http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local/Miami-Man-Gets-30-Years-For-Child-Porn-...

Any and I MEAN ANY sick AA member that tries to mitigate or make apologetic responses to this report are sick individuals.....

Comments

becket's picture

becket

Mon, 07/23/2012 - 21:42

"Get rid of this confession cult, that is all that I can say..."

Can we count on you, then, to just simply stop "contributing" here?? Otherwise you'll look every bit as much the liar as lfop.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

Conan

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 03:23

First post in the thread is a personal attack aimed at derailing. The fool will deny it, but she'll still be a fool.

Quite an interesting take on cult think too. It's more important to attack someone who attacks the cult than to stick to the topic.

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

Clara's picture

Clara

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 07:33

I cannot believe you, of all people, posted this. There are people that come to OPF solely to address one poster, and their posts often have nothing to do with the topic, just the poster. Wouldn't you say that any number of people are guilty of this?

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

becket's picture

becket

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 14:34

Your outrage at what has happened to these children didn't hit the meter, btnben. You wanna weigh in or just suck on your own pipe and pontificate?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Ironic's picture

Ironic

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 08:05

No becket, this site is for us to discuss why we don't like AA. I know you like to conveniently forget that.

You can call him a liar till you're blue in the face. I bet the Sun Sentinel is lying, too. No AA would ever rape children.

becket's picture

becket

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 08:10

You missed the point again. He concluded his post with "that's all I can say". If only it were true.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Mon, 07/23/2012 - 21:59

Man sentenced to 30 years in prison for filmed sexual abuse of Broward children

By Paula McMahon, Sun Sentinel
7:01 p.m. EDT, July 23, 2012

A man who admitted videotaping himself sexually assaulting two Dania Beach children — who he met by acting as their mother's sponsor at Alcoholics Anonymous — was sentenced Monday to 30 years in federal prison.

Randolph Pozdol, 68, of Miami, admitted earlier this year that he filmed himself abusing the boy and girl.

His crimes were discovered when downloads of online child pornography were traced to his Miami home. Investigators searched his house and found videotapes of the sexual assaults on the children, who appeared to have been drugged at the time.

The assaults occurred between January 2004 and November 17, 2006 when the boy was aged 7 to 9 and the girl was aged 4 to 6.

nvestigators said they also found more than 175 images and videos of child pornography that Pozdol downloaded from the internet.

The children's mother died in November 2006 of what Broward Sheriff's Office detectives say was an accidental self-inflicted drug overdose. The woman was in her early 40s, had a history of substance abuse and took a lethal dose of morphine and an antidepressant, investigators said.

The Sun Sentinel is not identifying the dead woman because it would disclose the identities of her children, the victims of sexual abuse.

The boy, now 14, and girl, now 12, were not in court but their adoptive parents, the dead woman's brother and sister, said they would be relieved to learn that Pozdol would be unable to hurt them again or harm other children.

Pozdol, whose attorney said he helped many people in AA during 20 years of sobriety, claimed he had a sex addiction and that the assaults on the children were a one-time aberration.

"A period of madness is why I'm here today," he told the judge in federal court in Miami.

pmcmahon@tribune.com, 954-356-4533 or Twitter @SentinelPaula

Source: http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/crime/fl-randolph-pozdol-sentence...

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

live_free_or_die's picture

live_free_or_die

Sun, 10/21/2012 - 18:21

is to be an AA member!

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 16:02

Randolph Pozdol convicted of FILMING and SEXUAL assault of apparently a drugged 4 and 6 year old boy and girl had his last known address in Dania Beach Florida in Broward county and claims he has helped many people in Alcoholics Anonymous during his 20 year tenure in that "fellowship." Dania Beach in the 33004 zip code and 754, 954 area codes is a densely populated beach community with a population density of 3,294.2 people per square mile (2000 Census) and the fellowship in that area appears to be controlled by the Broward County intergroup of Alcoholics Anonymous located in One River Plaza Building (Travel Guard Building) at 305 South Andrews Avenue - Fort Lauderdale FL 33301.

The Broward County Intergroup has the usual Alcoholics Anonymous loophole disclaimer claiming no attachment to Alcoholics Anonymous World Services, Inc. (AAWS) at the Interchurch Center in New York, despite the fact that they sell the literature of that organization and their website and Intergroup is advertized as a place to go and participate in the chanting rituals and ceremonies of Alcoholics Anonymous.

http://www.aabroward.org/index.asp

What "other" crimes have been committed associated by this 20 year good standing AA member that have been unreported by this fellowship due to the "anonymity" and insistence upon keeping crimes committed by its members and confessed too in its rituals secret?

http://www.ci.dania-beach.fl.us/

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

alkieanon's picture

alkieanon

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 05:43

A prime example of why there is the Marchman Act in Florida. Too bad it was not utilized in this instance.

http://www.dcf.state.fl.us/programs/samh/SubstanceAbuse/marchman/index.s...
http://www.dcf.state.fl.us/programs/abuse/howtoreport.shtml

Clara's picture

Clara

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 07:29

I am of the opinion that people that behave this way would do so regardless of most circumstances. He abused his girlfriend's children in a ive in situation. He could have met her anywhere. I disagree that a 2.5 year abuse is a "one time abberation." Seems pretty systematic to me. The sole conntection to AA is that is where he met the mom. His crime would be no less bad if he'd met her at a coffee shop. He was a sick man no matter where he ever was. Good thing he is in jail.

Interesting that this would come after all the stuff about Penn State. Talk about some hateful blogs. Sandusky would have been a child molestor even if he hadn't ever been at Penn State. What I don't understand is why he was permitted access to the facililities and even maintained an office there after having been "retired." Had that simple measure been taken, Penn State would have limited any involvement, but it wouldn't have kept Sandusky from molesting children. I think it is unfair to penalize players and students that had nothing to do with it.

And I feel similarly toward AA. To me, that he met the woman in AA only serves a purpose on this board only. I could go to a parenting board and find a blog on why women don't notice when their kids are being abused. This woman died of an overdose in 2006. Perhaps there was alot going on in this house that falls on the shoulders of the adults in charge, nothing else.

He is where he belongs and he deserves more... Be cautious of all people you meet.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

patti

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 07:56

The Mother of the children met him in aa @ meetings. Therefore there were multiple encounters. Due to meeting him in aa where she was told to admit powerlessness, turn her will & life over to an hp, follow instructions & steps, submit to a sponsor telling her what to do with her thoughts, feelings & life & that she was now part of the greatest "fellowship" in the world. Where else in the world is someone told all these things? How can one be both powerless & told to trust aa & have faith & believe, believe & believe but always be alert, aware & vigilant. In other environments this women would have not been told she was powerless & that she must submit to being powerless & to a sponsor & to absolutely adhere to the instructions & practices or she would die, or jail or an institution. aa & its absurd psycho babble & lunatic instructions prepares lambs for the slaughter. This is solid & straight up cult stuff & can't happen anywhere. If this woman had been drinking in a bar & met this man she would have been more vigilant & aware & not been told she was part of a wonderful fellowship. This is one of the most disgusting things about aa & its members & you that you lie & lie & say these situations could happen anywhere. Not true the rest of the world does not operate amid cult instructions & people are not instructed to believe, have faith & trust other members of society blindly as they are told to do in aa. aa is a cult & dictates vulnerability & swears & lies that that is the way to stop an addiction. I don't know how any aa member sleeps at night actually. Ultimately you all become one & the same with wilson & have sociopath & narcissist behaviors & mentalities & a lack of conscience or any concern for the well being of any one in the cult. No Clara you are telling the standard aa member lie regarding this one & lying & saying this could happen anywhere in the world. Not true but what else is new or different about a stepper lying & being a liar.

patti

becket's picture

becket

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 14:31

"If this woman had been drinking in a bar & met this man she would have been more vigilant & aware . . . "

If this woman had been nursing a drink for two hours, maybe she would have had the radar on and operating properly. I don't know what kind of lightweight you are, patti, but if this woman had been drinking in a bar she would more than likely been relatively defenseless against this guy's line of shit. Just an observation about the power of alcohol once it's in the bloodstream and brain. Six or eight shots within the same two hours and she would have been unable to do much of anything. Twelve ounces of whiskey means the liver has to spend 12 hours processing. She would be shit-faced for a good long while and unable to protect herself, her kids, her life. She did actually die of an "accidental drug overdose" - you don't think she was really sipping a $9 Cosmo in that bar, waiting for Mr. Right, do you? Obliteration was apparently her MO. She fucked up and her kids are now dragging the baggage.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 02:35

"She fucked up and her kids are now dragging the baggage"...

Yes and no Becket. She actually probably thought she was doing the right thing after being encouraged by a counselor to join AA and later lovebombed by the members that likely enticed her to stay. There she was billshitted into believing that she would have her desire to use substances magically lifted by way of a spiritual experience. “K.C.B.”, “It works if you work it”, “Don’t leave before the miracle happens”.

She very well could have been doing everything "right" as instructed by AA, believing and entrusting her life in the fellowship and her sponsor. It could also be that she never woke up from a binge, drinking/drugging after discovering she had been duped by the beloved program and the sick fuck of a sponsor had been fiddling with her children. AA killed her and destroyed her family.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 15:57

I just don't buy this. Even the Jews in Auschwitz were stronger than that. The mother was a selfish substance slave, but had wits enough about her to get her hands on the substances she overdosed on. She wasn't a dazed, lax pushover as far as I can tell. She was more interested in getting what she wanted than in protecting her kids. And that's not "doing everything right as instructed by AA".

She killed herself with her own self-centeredness and her preference for addiction rather than sobriety. AA did not instruct her to behave like that. AA did not instruct her "sponsor"/sick fuck to act as he did, either. They both made choices and left a shitload of wreckage. Too bad for all involved, but AA is not culpable. The Big Book simply does not teach men to screw children. That was his idea, not a program recommendation.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

mfc66uk

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 07:39

The fact that it was his sponcees children shows that he used his AA membership and the credibility it gained him with the family of these children to commit these disgusting crimes. There are many who are damaged and vulnerable who go to AA and others like this man who are predators and have an easy task in the rooms due to the lack of accountability.
I am glad that I never let many AA members know where I lived as you never know exactly who you are amongst in those groups.

Clara's picture

Clara

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 07:59

MFC, it has been my experience that can happen anywhere, even on these boards for no better reason that someone is expressing an opinion contrary to yours. Sick people are sick people.

How do you know that it wasn't the fact that he lived in their home with them and was in a relationship with their mother that gave him credibility? What about all of the other instances of these crimes where no party is involved with AA?

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

Conan's picture

Conan

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 09:12

as those who will not see.

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

becket's picture

becket

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 14:14

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Ironic's picture

Ironic

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 08:09

But it's more likely to happen in the roomz. Can't find multiple articles per day about sexual predators who happen to be McDonald's eaters, but there's many articles about sexual predators who "happen" to be in the Program™

Clara's picture

Clara

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 08:28

Do you have proof to support your opinion? I do know McDONALD'S franchisee that WOULDN'T put in the playground. Wonder why....

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 09:15

You are protecting an organization that ignores that children and other vulnerable people habitually become victims. Alcoholics Anonymous ignores it because they are greedy. If they weren't so greedy they would address the situation in some way. They don't fucking care that people are being harmed. And you defend them. I’m disgusted that you support this organization that ignores this.

It can happen anywhere? No, it CAN'T! It doesn't happen at my house and if there was ever a sign that it was possible or any threat SOMETHING WOULD BE DONE. It's called responsibility.

AA should not say, "We aren't responsible"...That's all, done with. Ignore it. Move on.

AA should say, "This is a horrible circumstance. What can we do to prevent it? We are going to do all that we can as a loving, spiritual, caring support group." They don’t because they are not a loving, spiritual, caring support group. They suck! Alcoholics Anonymous has the ability to step up, evaluate, digest, and take action. What is AA’s part in the situation??????

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

becket's picture

becket

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 14:10

I submit that, aside from the obvious culpability of the abuser, it is primarily the mother of these children who was remiss in protecting them. Apply some perspective here. "It doesn't happen at my house and if there was ever a sign that it was possible or any threat SOMETHING WOULD BE DONE. It's called responsibility." This is the first line of defense. Who in AA would you hold accountable when you evidently would not hold the mother accountable? It was only upon her death that the abuse allegedly ended.

Were these crimes committed by a criminal or by an alcoholic? I contend it was a criminal who committed the crimes, and the fact that he was opportunistically cruising AA is despicable. How does that make AA responsible for these children's abuse? Wouldn't the criminal by overt acts and the mother by negligence be responsible for these crimes? AA does not condone this sort of behavior. If you are going to argue that AA "allows" it to happen, then you should also argue that every place on earth "allows" it to happen. I was raped at age 9 at a creek in the woods. I was incested in the basement of my home several times before I turned 12. I was molested at my neighbor's house by my best friend's brother at age 8. I did not imply or grant permission for any of it. Sexual abuse thrives everywhere, not just in AA. There IS no safe place when a deviant decides to act. He or she will make it happen no matter when or where.

I think you're just angry that it happens and you want to hang it on somebody. Easier to blame a large, international group than it would be to make charges against an individual and actually go to court. It's easy to be incensed from a living room armchair with a kitten in one's lap and a glass of mint tea on the table and a 52" t.v. blaring "Dancing With The Stars". There is no lonelier place on the planet than to be the suffering kid whose childhood has been stolen by a selfish predator.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 03:16

The point is that if she had not met this man in AA were she was likely encouraged to get a sponsor, definitely encouraged to entrust him with very personal details of her life, and where he instinctively knew that he was in an advantageous situation, then this wouldn't have occurred at all. In all other situations in which a woman is getting therapeutic help by a world wide known and respected organization, she would have been protected by regulations and laws. He would have been trained as a professional and monitored by other parties, both of which would have the understanding that if there were ever a need she could seek assistance and be listened to. It is not that this man was ever above the law by being an AA member, however he likely felt that it was a situation that he less danger of being suspect. You are right that I am angry but unless details about this mother’s personality are divulged to make me think otherwise I'll assume that she is like most others. Sick, fearful, desperate, and broken enough to trust when she was push in and pulled in to do so. Instincts are powerful but in AA we are encouraged not to trust them. Not to trust our thinking. We are told that we need to, HAVE TO, have faith in practically anything but ourselves.

You said there is no safe place when a deviant decides to act. I believe you are wrong Becket. If this were the case no one would lock their doors at night. We wouldn’t teach our children of stranger danger or carry mace, look over our shoulders, run away, fight, or scream.

When I think of AA and the crime problem I normally don’t dream of redemption I think of prevention. In the next year or five years there will be more cases. More children abused, women raped, others scammed. By logic, with some changes in the system, those are avoidable. I really wish that AA would bite the bullet and make some changes. It’s possible although some poor alcoholics will have to struggle through having safety regulations rather than pitiful traditions. But better that then more people getting harmed. It doesn’t have to be this way but it is.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 16:07

She shouldn't have invited a lecherous old fuck to sponsor her. AA frowns on opposite sex sponsorship, as you know. (Please don't bring Clara into this - she made her decision and I have nothing to say about it.)

I'm not convinced this woman had any intention of trying not to drink or use again. We've all seen poseurs come into meetings and try to lay down some shit about good intentions, all the while looking for somebody who's holding, somebody to score from.

You're trying to apply logic to this situation? There is no logic in it. Even if AA were to try to put the kibosh on these situations, they would still occur, because you are talking about people existing on the most base, primitive level of their lives. They are going to be looking for pain relief, companionship, safety. AA is not exactly brimming with people who can brag about their calm command of life. It's a piss-poor place to look for solutions to psychological problems.

I think it would be appropriate for a chairperson to read some sort of safety message before meetings, and maybe even at the end of meetings as people disperse and leave the building. I cannot see AA ever endorsing that worldwide. Because each group is autonomous, I don't see why people don't just pick up the reins and make these modifications in the name of safety. Those who would be put off by it - probably criminals and scammers and active users - would perhaps then move on to other meetings. Eventually maybe all regional meetings could adopt the measure. But there are, of course, many fiery hoops to be jumped through to get it accepted.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 16:19

As usual, the apologetic AA member blames the victim. The children's mother was a victim of Randolph Pozdol, when she let him into her life in Dania Beach compliments of Broward County Alcoholics Anonymous. Pozdol was even investigated for the death of the children's mother he was molesting. The mother of the victims that the pedophile Randolph Pozdol most likely had apologetic AA members telling her that AA is safe and to trust the fellowship. What they forgot to tell her is that she would be used an excuse for not working to make AA safer and the blame would be put on her if anything goes wrong, just as the above post shows........

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:49

Haven't I read somewhere that AA women have been known to surround newbies when the new ones are making naive mistakes? Oh yeah, it was here on this forum. Anyway, I don't believe she was a victim. I believe her children were the victims in this scenario. You tell me how she was victimized. She made decisions that were not in her best interests. She was not murdered; she overdosed. Not a victim.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:56

Randolph Pozdol video taped having sex with the mother in a passed out state and then her children in a drugged state. Same equals same....

I do appreciate your AA apologetic stance searching for loopholes in the Randolph Pozdol case though. I am sure that psychologists, sociologists and anthropologists will also...... http://orange-papers.org/forum/node/2050

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:12

Did he force her to drink or take drugs? Did he pour booze down her throat or hit her up with whatever drugs she was taking? Didn't see anything about that. Reads like she was fully capable of getting shit-faced on her own, without this creep's help.

Not a victim. Stupid enough to set herself and her children up, but she herself was not a victim.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

causeandeffect's picture

causeandeffect

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:18

dupe

Troll free AA critical forum
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"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

causeandeffect's picture

causeandeffect

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:18

So stupid people can't be victims? Only intelligent people are victims? How do you know he didn't slip ruffies or something similar on her? Predators do that, you know. How is anybody to know exactly how she got wasted? We can't know because most likely nobody knows besides them. You are making assumptions.

Troll free AA critical forum
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"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:29

This woman had no insight and no judgment about the quality of the company she kept. She made one bad decision after another. She was crafty and seemed to get all of her own needs met, but didn't take the time to give a fuck about her kids.

The kids are the victims. This woman had no excuse for her behavior. If alcoholism is not a disease, and it is instead a voluntary behavior, a choice that is made, then she chose to drink and do dope and put herself and her kids at risk. She is the one who jeoparidized their wellbeing. He was an opportunist who saw a glowing invitation and took it.

The children: victims. The mother: not a victim. Selfish, shallow, negligent, but not a victim.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

causeandeffect's picture

causeandeffect

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:59

vic·tim/ˈviktəm/
Noun:

A person harmed, injured, or killed as a result of a crime, accident, or other event or action.
A person who is tricked or duped: "the victim of a hoax".

Certainly the children (not all children everywhere) were victims, but do you believe that she was fully aware that he was a child molester? Do you believe it was impossible that she was tricked or duped, or that she was harmed by his actions?

Troll free AA critical forum
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"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:13

I don't think she gave a shit whether he was a child molester or not. She was in it for herself. That's what drunks and addicts do - they center everything around themselves.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

causeandeffect's picture

causeandeffect

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:20

Billshit! You can't know that. Not all drunks and drug addicts are like that. You are just parroting cult dogma.

Troll free AA critical forum
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"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:32

The crime occurred before the guy ever got his pants off. The mother broke the cardinal rule of parenting: you never put your children in jeopardy. EVER. That, and the fact that her drinking and drugging took precedence over the care and nurturing of her children, was the crime that harmed them all. The shit that this sleazy Pozdol fuck did was a chronological afterthought.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Clara's picture

Clara

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 20:48

The stat I read had children of live in partners are 8 times more likely to be abused than children in married relationships. Add the drug and alcohol abuse, and I would think that could increase it.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 23:31

Ah, but only in AA, right, Clara? ;-)

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Clara's picture

Clara

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 16:33

Yes, but even JR would be the first to say 'women with the women and men with the men." He wouldn't be the first person to voice that stance to me, a pretty strong woman, and it is supported in our literature. I doubt that anyone told her to get a man for a sponsor, become romantically involved with him, and to move him in with her children.

This man was a criminal. He would have behaved this way toward children if he had met Mom in Starbucks.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

Clara's picture

Clara

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 15:33

How can they prevent it? Well, Avo, how CAN they prevent it? This woman made the choice to involve herself with this man in a relationship that even exceeded the norm for sponsor/sponsee. It IS a horrible circumstance by any measure. There is already a pamphlet on sponsorship, and it is a recommendation of men with men and women with the women. But it is only a recocmmendation. There is no one in NY that is going to say, "Now, Clara..."

The potential for abuse is everywhere, even in our own homes. Haven't you heard of the man in Texas that had a party on his ranch and one of his guest molested his daughter? He unintentionally killed him when he caught him in the act. I am sure he always felt his home was safe and no one he would allow around his family was an animal. Would you be surprised to discover that most abuse takes place in familiar areas by familiar people?

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 03:33

Is the question how they can help prevent it or should they? Why ask how the changes could happen if you don't think that they should be changed? AA isn't stumped about what to do, they aren't willing to do anything at all. Since they are insistent about getting at least 10% of the passed hat $ collected get kicked back up to them, perhaps they can AT THE VERY LEAST insist that within the 20 minutes of bullshit readings (that all members have already memorized anyway), a paragraph about safety is read. Just for starters this is more than reasonable and easily transitional. But no, nothing at all is done. AA sucks. They are spineless, greedy, and lacking any ethics or morals.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Clara's picture

Clara

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 16:34

But we already have a sponsorship pamphlet that says men with men and women with women. Seems to me that she made a wrong dating choice, and no pamphlet or reading at the beginning of the meeting is going to change that.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

becket's picture

becket

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 19:52

If she made an error in judgment and decided to date this skum, that is outside the scope of AA anyway. Read your own tagline, JR Harris, about outside issues.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

avogadno's picture

avogadno

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 07:11

The sponsorship pamphlet is not a warning about safety. It's a piece of cult literature on how to keep sponsees under control and in the cult. Yes, they do mention the same gender relationship. That's a good thing. Too bad some people that are aware of that suggestion ignore it, but that's their choice I guess...This pamphlet sits around gathering dust half of the time. Seriously Clara, it's not suitable as an importatn document regarding the AA problem of stalking and abuse. This is a topic that needs to be heard about in every meeting so that every newcomer knows and every potential abuser feels less secure.

Pro Empowerment!
Truth about AA: http://orange-papers.org/menu1.html
Expose AA: http://www.expaa.org/

Clara's picture

Clara

Fri, 07/27/2012 - 07:33

Due to the Fourth tradition, there just might be meetings that have some sort of warning. I have also sat in on workshops on sponsoring that talk about this issue.

I never had a problem with it because I wanted a sponsor to help me and someone that I trusted. He had helped me in so many situations and already had a trust relationship. We had also been friends for a long time through my father. I wasn't looking for a daddy or someone to date, something that leapt at me immediately when I read the cheesy piece on The Fix, where she chose male sponsors based on her physical attraction to them and mentioned her frustration when one said he wouldn't be dating or sleeping with her. It goes to motive.

And, again, we can have pamphlets of any kind in the our meetings, but no one is required to read them. I am sure that all these pamphlets that people say should be produced by AA would be read about as often as Penny's example of the ones that come with medication. Despite the three prong approach of manufacturer's pamphlets, the warning labels on bottles themselves, plus the consult with the pharmacist when (s)he gives it to you... people still misuse or abuse their meds.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

JR Harris's picture

JR Harris

Thu, 07/26/2012 - 16:24

In Alcoholics Anonymous you aren't supposed to take other peoples inventory and only keep your side of the street clean. As usual, once a way is found to blame the problems of AA on the victims, the members of the fellowship rejoice and all join in, following in the footsteps of the pagan confession cult built by the spiritualist Bill Wilson.

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

Ironic's picture

Ironic

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 09:42

Why should I show you proof? You make an outrageous claim you can't back up at least once a day here and have never even been able to provide evidence that AA works.

Pretty cheeky of you to expect me to cite everything I say. Actually, I did that for the first couple months here..then I realized no matter how much proof I provided, I just couldn't type louder than someone who has got entire days to waste fighting with people on a website built for a cause they disagree with.

Where's that proof that AA works Clara? You find it yet? Ive asked you multiple times. I'm not debating you by different rules anymore.

As far as that proof goes, again, we see these articles about sexual predators in AA multiple times per day. How often do we see one about sexual predators sentenced to fast food chains? Since you've got so much time on your hands, how about you find a few, and we will compare them to the mass quantity of articles about perverts in the Program™

Clara's picture

Clara

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 10:23

I see proof daily, Ironic, and I've said so. I am personal proof. But I am not suggesting a higher incident of abuse for something just because I don'tike it. And you are right. I am fortunately able to give as much time to this as any hobby.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

Ironic's picture

Ironic

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 14:43

What, pray tell, makes your anecodtal evidence stronger than anyone else's? If you want to go by anecdotes and how many individual stories can be found, it is very clear that AA is dangerous.

You've got one anecdote. How many did LFOD link to?

Clara's picture

Clara

Tue, 07/24/2012 - 15:36

JR and Anti have a hobby where they try to find anything they can about AA, but when you measure the instances against the fact that abuse happens every day, all over the world, it seems pretty insignificant. Having said that, it shouldn't have any time of day, anyplace in the world.

My evidence is strong enough for me, Ironic, and the many I see in the rooms for whom AA has been successful despite everything else they tried. I also know people that have tried everything out there, but nothing worked and they are still using.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

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