Boniface: Intercessor of Addictions

As most of us know, according to AA lore, Bill Wilson was aided by a dead monk named Boniface when he wrote the 12&12. However, it is unclear exactly which Boniface Wilson was referring to. My guess is that he was referring to Saint Boniface, who is known as "The Intercessor of Addictions." Could this be the Boniface Wilson claimed help guide his hand as he wrote the literature that is now chanted worldwide in church basements?

Links:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWDPq1BEigE&feature=related

http://www.comeandseeicons.com/b/mgp27.htm

Thou hast shown thyself, O God-inspired Boniface, as a guide to the orthodox faith, a teacher of true worship and purity, O star of the universe and companion of the bishops, O wise one. Through thy light thou hast enlightened all, O harp of the Spirit. Therefore, intercede with Christ to save our souls.

St. Boniface was born in Devonshire, England in 680. His baptismal name was Wilfrid. At age 5, he decided he wanted to be a monk, after meeting some. He was educated at the monastery near Exeter from ages 7 to 15. Then he went to Nursling Abbey at Winchester. He studied under Winbert, becoming a monk and a teacher in the school. He was ordained priest at age 30. In 716, he made his first missionary trip to northern Germany. He met with little success and returned home. The monks tried to persuade him to stay by electing him abbot upon the death of Winbert. Determined to be a missionary, he went to Pope Gregory II, in 718, and received a commission to evangelize Germany, along with a new name, Boniface. He preached in Hesse and assisted Willibrord in Friesland. In 722, he was recalled to Rome to be consecrated as regional Bishop for Germany. When he returned to Hesse, he decided to strike paganism at the root, literally. He announced the time he would cut down the sacred oak of Thor and destroy the pagan idols there. He cut down the oak, demonstrating that the pagan gods were powerless to defend themselves. Many came to the Faith and were baptized. In Thuringia, he found some Celtic and Frankish priests, but they were more hindrance than help to the work of converting the native population. Young monastics from England heard of his success and flocked to join the work. They learned the native dialects and preached in village, countryside and town. A monastery was established at Ohrdruf to serve as a missionary headquarters. In 731, St. Boniface was elevated to Metropolitan of Germany beyond the Rhine and given authority to establish sees throughout the region adn to organize the church. This he did. Upon the death of Charles Martel, he took the opportunity to repair the damage done to the church in France, weeding out unworthy priests and restoring order. In 747, he became Metropolitan of Mainz with authority over all of Germany and Gaul. In 754, (in his 70's) he resigned the see in Mainz to St. Lull, in order to return to Friesland to reconvert the area, which had lapsed into paganism after St. Willibrord's death. It was June of 755. He and Eoban were preparing to baptize and chrismate a group of new converts. He was reading in his tent awaiting the arrival of the converts when a band of pagans began to attack the camp. St. Boniface exhorted his companions not to defend him or themselves, but to welcome the opportunity to die for the Faith. He was the first to fall. His body was taken to Fulda along with the bloodstained book, where it is venerated to this day.

This icon is by the hand of Nicholas Papas. It is part of a mural of special intercessors at St. Michael Antiochian Orthodox Church, Greensburg, PA. St. Boniface intercedes for those dealing with alcohol and other addictions.

Comments

NoAAUK's picture

Why would a good Soul from the other side wish to contact a lying, thieving, conman, acid popping, sexual predator like Wilson? Who had no scruples whatsoever about terrifying the vulnerable with lies and misinformation in order to con them into joining his death cult so he could prey on them for both financial and sexual gain. The steppers claim of "its not the messenger that counts, but the message" is just more denial by these sickos of the true nature of AA.

Any medium worth their salt will tell you NOT to attempt to contact the other side or next level of consciousness or whatever you want to call it, without training, as there are malignant entities out there, that just want to cause harm

Isn't it much more likely that an evil entity would guide an evil person to form an lying scaremongering predatory death cult like AA? Why would "a teacher of true worship and purity" want to associate with the likes of Frank Buchman Bill Wilson or Smith?

Steppism is a lying scaremongering cult designed to prey on the vulnerable in order to cause them even more harm to the point of suicide, it is like a festering cancer eating away at the soul of humanity, it is satans cult......you can feel the evil around you when you attend one of their cult indoctrination sessions they call meetings.

It was satan who aided wilson to form the cult of steppism, not Saint boniface or any other saint.

I belive a good entity from the other side would be much more likely to aid Orange write the Orange Papers

......and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Matthew 24:11

becket's picture

So you believe in "friendly" and "malevolent" spirits, NoAAUK? Have you contacted any of them? Have you consistently used mediums "worth their salt"?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

NoAAUK's picture

"So you believe in "friendly" and "malevolent" spirits, NoAAUK?"

Yes, and I have dabbled in spiritualism...................Your point?

We of the Anti AA movement are all different individuals with a whole range of different experiences and beliefs, we are not slogan spouting cult zombies.

We have ONE shared belief........that steppism is a lying scaremongering predatory death cult, a haven for control freaks and sexual predators

......and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Matthew 24:11

becket's picture

" . . . we are not slogan spouting cult zombies."

"We have ONE shared belief........that steppism is a lying scaremongering predatory death cult, a haven for control freaks and sexual predators"

That looks a fair bit like a slogan to me, alt-cult guy. And "we" indicates a group, a movement, a faction, a cult.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Orange's picture

RE:
"I believe a good entity from the other side would be much more likely to aid Orange write the Orange Papers."

Yeh! I feel cheated. Where are my ghosts and spirits and spooks, entertaining me with wild and sordid tales from the other side?

live_free_or_die's picture

for his creative contributions to the 12&12.

Just another instance of bill w bending an author over the writing table and giving his best.

This is, without a doubt, the Boniface that bill w says helped him pen the 12&12.

Good job.

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

live_free_or_die's picture

.

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

YuppieMonkey's picture

In the book Pass It On there is a quote by Louis Wilson about how Bill wrote the 12 steps guided by spirits that he contacted through his Ouija board. He was using this scam for a long time.
This more than anything pushed my opinion of Bill W from fallible well intentioned savior, to lying conman. Even the infidelity was something I cut him some slack, thinking that I shouldn't stick my nose in things that were not my business. Maybe Louis and him were not getting along for years? Maybe she was seeing someone for awhile? Maybe he was sick and couldn't overcome his urge for sex? Who knows, mind your own business I would think.
But his talking to dead people was just flat out lying to gain status among desperate people looking for an answer. That, plus the fact that the steps and the rest of the AA program was simply becoming a nightmare to follow was why I packed my shit and left.
So why did these spirits contact him? To tell him to tweak the cult religion he was attending (the Oxford Group) and take their 6 steps and turn them into 12? Really? They weren't even going to enlighten him with anything new? And of all the methods available, he should just happen to copy and rearrange the one program he happened to be attending? Hmm.

"You'll pay to know what you really think". - J.R. Bob Dobbs

@Ben,
"by Louis Wilson"
Correction- Lois Wilson. Amazing how Conan (Ben) sits on his butt while his buddy butchers the english language.

rainbow's picture

Is that all ya got? A spelling correction?

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becket's picture

So, msafrany, are you contending Bill Wilson lied about trying to contact the dead, or that he did in fact try to contact the dead? Which is the greater offense, all things considered?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

live_free_or_die's picture

judge bucket said "So, msafrany, are you contending Bill Wilson lied about trying to contact the dead, or that he did in fact try to contact the dead? Which is the greater offense, all things considered?"

Hey becket, all things considered, William Griffith Wilson (a/k/a bill w) was just a crazy lunatic.

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

becket's picture

lfop, you attempted to weigh in on the question I asked but you did not answer it. Is it so difficult for you to appreciate the differences between "a" and "b" referenced in the question?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

live_free_or_die's picture

http://www.unexplainable.net/ghost-paranormal/12_step_program_was_invent...
"As bizarre and tabloidesque as it sounds, Bill Wilson, co-founder of the religious organization Alcoholics Anonymous was a fervent spiritualist who believed in the power of Ouija boards and even channeled the other side in order to divine the details of the controversial twelve step program. Along with Wilson's connection with the dead, he studied with Aldous Huxley in LSD experiments and even wrote letters to the deceased Carl Jung."

Please not the linked website ghosts and paranormal?

Bwhahahahahahahahahaha

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

becket's picture

I'm sorry, is this an attempt to address my question or just an impotent statement in the face of it?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

I will ask Boniface himself and get back to OPF with his response when he contacts me.

Orange's picture

The Catholics even have a patron saint of addictions and alcoholism? I didn't know that.

Now, do I dare to ask this?

Do they have a patron saint of diddling alter boys?

Clara's picture

There is also Saint Monica, the patorn saint of alcoholic women.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

for 6 beer binges, crab soup & shithouse driving.
6 beer binge, ya still here pretending, clara !!!!!! you must have no life at all.

Brett

Clara's picture

Well, Brett, I am a part of yours or you wouldn't post to me! That's a luxury of its own!

Say, do you have any availability to opals?

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

well yes I suppose so, like toilet paper is a part of my life.

Brett

becket's picture

So Brett, why not rid yourself of Clara and toilet paper? Don't read her posts, and use your hands. Evidently that's the area in which you excel.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

"Evidently that's the area in which you excel." Where's the evidence bucket? Brett's post only mentions a propensity for using said toilet paper. You seem to be the one with all the expertise at using hands. Shit slinging again are we bucket.

Take a deep breath and slow down. Your overwhelming need to be unpleasant and insulting is overriding your ability to reason.

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

you speak like clara & toilet paper are a bad thing, although they may well amount to the same thing, I would suggest both serve a purpose & do a job, not altogether that different from each other, but jobs that need to be done nether the less.
speaking of jobs, have you got off ya bludgen arse & found any gainful employment yet ? maybe if you let go off it, you're hands could lean to do something else.
you wouldn't know truth from turds ya fkn turkey.

Brett

rainbow's picture

Uh-oh, Clara. You misspelled yet *another* word. Don't let Calinda catch you doing that.

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Clara's picture

I don't think I post without misspelling... Nice to see you, Rainbow.

Remember Christopher Stevens when you vote.

becket's picture

It's "altar boys", not "alter" boys, although their lives surely must have been altered by these particular dastardly deeds. St. Dymphna has recently been popularly appointed to be the patron saint of the sexually abused, but this is not recognized by the Catholic Church. Instead, she has been the patron saint for those with mental illnesses and what used to be called "lunacy", since at least the early 1600s.

Surely you're not making a joke of priests sexually abusing boys and girls, are you Orange?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

St Boniface is the patron saint of brewers.

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

becket's picture

The St. Boniface whom you mention is also the patron saint of tailors and file-cutters, so see if you can fit that in to your character assassination, won't you?

Search here for more material: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02656a.htm This is the authentic website for everything Catholic.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

JR Harris's picture

And who "bestowed" the official "authentic website" designation for all Catholics? Was it given this designation by the Interchurch Center on 475 Riverside Drive in New York or the Vatican in Rome?

"Tradition 10 - Alcoholics Anonymous has no opinion on outside issues; hence the AA name ought never be drawn into public controversy." Please follow orders from the Interchurch Center if you are an AA member and don't comment.

becket's picture

Check it out. This is not my assessment of the website. It just so happens to be legitimate doctrine and dogma from the Roman Catholic Church. Tough shit if you don't like it.

And it has nothing to do with your fetish with the "Interchurch Center on 475 Riverside Drive in New York." There have been no squawks from the Vatican.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

He's primarily the patron saint of brewers and Fulda in Germany. He's got fuck all to do with addiction. Love the way you looked it up and got all defensive - whackjob, again.

What character assassination? Bill W? He did a far too good a job of that himself.

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

becket's picture

Defensive? Not at all. Just adding the rest of the story so your version can be seen for what it's worth: not much, just a cheap shot. I don't have to look this stuff up, dollface. I was raised Catholic. There are many, many things a cradle Catholic never forgets.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

You didn't know that - you looked it up and then came back being your usual know-it-all. Keep it up. You are a constant source of amusement. There's nothing funnier than a dumb fuck who thinks they're clever.

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

live_free_or_die's picture

"Liked"

Alcoholics Anonymous: MyNotGodHasItCovered®
http://www.expaa.org/
http://bereanresearch.com/
http://badrecovery.blogspot.com/
NOT AA:
Rational Recovery, SOS, HAMS
http://alcoholabusesolutions.com/

becket's picture

Why would I lie to you when the truth is so compelling? I have no reason to lie. You obviously have no earthly perception of what it is like to have been raised since conception as a dutiful Catholic. If you want to look into a real cult, you can abandon all this "btnben's voice" bullshit on the OPF and research Roman Catholicism. It's much more interesting and much more spirit-killing.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

causeandeffect's picture

do you believe that wilson was able to use an ouija board to contact a saint? Any saint at all?

Troll free AA critical forum
http://www.expaa.org/

"The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it." ~ Neil deGrasse Tyson

Pennywise's picture

I believe, and I could be wrong, that Becket's philosophy precludes her from acknowledging the objective truth or falsity of any claim. It seems she would have to hold that if Bill thought he did, then to him he did, and there is no ultimate truth beyond that. But of course I cannot speak for her. Becket, do I have it right?

"Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid."

becket's picture

Pennywise, you are as close as anyone on this forum has ever tried to get. I put the power of the human mind and imagination at the forefront of life's experiences, not the grim, drab, looming buzz-kill of One Objective Universal Truth and Reality by which we must measure our experiences.

If Bill Wilson thought he engaged Boniface in communication, perhaps he did. If you contend he threw the name Boniface out there for Catholic priests to latch onto so they would support his vision, perhaps he did. I make no judgments about his business acumen, his experiences, his bank account, his sexual conduct, or any of it. Truly, it doesn't interest me. The man brought forth something that has helped some people. He treated it as a business venture. I guess that was pretty smart, but I'm not a business person. And now he's dead and gone and the mice are at play with the treatment centers and the high-dollar enrollments in their programs, and the contamination of one guy's idea nearly 80 years ago. It's a cluster fuck.

All the griping does nothing. Get out there, people, and clean it up if you want it cleaned up. It won't clean itself up, that's for damn sure.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

Do you really believe wilson was able to conjure up Saints with his ouija board?

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

becket's picture

What I believe has no impact either way on Bill Wilson's actions or afterlife. That is between him and his God. I'm certain Bill Wilson was "able to use a ouija board" for whatever purpose he chose.

I do not believe Bill Wilson was a dutiful Catholic during these years; I know nothing of his attending Mass every Sunday or on Holy Days of Obligation, or tithing 10% of his earnings, or any of the rest of it. If he was a fallen-away/lapsed Catholic, he was acting outside the doctrine and dogma of the Catholic Church. And I am hardly a dutiful Catholic myself, having long ago abandoned attendance at Mass, Confession, Absolution, etc. So maybe it would make more sense to find an authentically devout Roman Catholic and ask him or her your question.

EDIT for PENNYWISE: My interpretation of the question was, "was it possible for wilson to use the Ouija board . . . ", not "do you believe Bill Wilson was able to speak to the dead through a Ouija board?" Of course it was possible for him to use a Ouija board for any purpose; I can't say whether or not he was successful in his use of the Ouija board. He could have used it to prop up the end of a sagging couch or he could have used it for a cutting board for potatoes. Would he have been successful? If it's not documented, it's anyone's guess. My personal belief is that one need not use a Ouija board to contact any saint on any particular topic. Even though I left the Catholic Church decades ago, I have kept all the saints in a comfortable corral and I ask for their intercession often. Do they respond? Who knows? If we can't confirm that they do respond, then neither can we confirm that they do NOT respond.

We are all free to believe what we wish. If anyone thinks the whole notion of patron saints, or saints in general, is hogwash, I feel my life is too short and precious to squander my days trying to convince him otherwise. Believe what you will.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

"Why would I lie to you when the truth is so compelling? I have no reason to lie."

You lie continuously on this board. Are you Marietta Davis as was on here? Here comes another lie.

You lied about not needing to look anything up. Saying you didn't look anything up and then giving the link where you didn't look it up is a bit dumb (Marietta normal though). I'd love to hear what a file-cutter is? Just wondering how long it will take you to look it up. Please don't try and tell anyone you remember a word from your childhood into your sixties without knowing its meaning. The brain doesn't work like that.

You have often been called boring M. Is this a bit of denial seeping in? For my own part, I must say that I regularly start to lose the will to live when wading through the mire of one of your posts. Now that is a class of boring that is way out on its own. Is mega-boring a word? Giga-boring?

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

becket's picture

Oh, brother. Notating sources is a sore point on this board, so I gave you a link where you could look up what I already knew and you could verify it for yourself. Jesus, so fuckin suspicious you are.

"Please don't try and tell anyone you remember a word from your childhood into your sixties without knowing its meaning. The brain doesn't work like that." THIS IS MEANINGLESS. Just what is it you're trying to say? You think I'm lying? I don't have to defend myself to you. You are nothing to me, just another shallow gadfly (yes, I know what it means and I use the word in all sincerity and with all authority, as I have known the word since I was 13 years old).

"You have often been called boring M. Is this a bit of denial seeping in? For my own part, I must say that I regularly start to lose the will to live when wading through the mire of one of your posts. Now that is a class of boring that is way out on its own. Is mega-boring a word? Giga-boring?" If you find what I write boring, consider this an engraved invitation to skip over my posts. You fail to understand them anyway; your time would be better spent skimming the surface of any other intelligent post, from which you will learn absolutely nothing because, as a know-it-all, you cannot learn.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

On Google?

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

becket's picture

Who wants to know?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Conan's picture

That you're a lying piece of crap bucket. You didn't know about Der Heilige Bonifatus until you looked him up. So full of shit it's funny. This exchange has been saved for future use you lying sack of shit.

Danny is currently "Rachel" - watch out folks, he's learned how to use a spell checker...lol

rainbow's picture

that explains sooooooooooooooooooooo much

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becket's picture

So, rainbow, since you have appointed yourself resident expert on Catholicism and its relevance and practice in modern day society, please expound on your assertion that my being raised Catholic "explains soooooooooooooooooooo much".

If I were the betting type, I would have no problem laying down house and home that you have no idea the scope or the complexity of what you claim. Would love to read an articulate, pointed, fact-filled, authentic dissertation on your allegation. If you can't provide that, it will devalue every remark you post thereafter, because you will then fail to be a person of your word and an individual with the integrity to stand behind a remark such as the one you have made.

By the way, we are talking Roman Catholic here, as in the religion; "catholic" with a lower-case c is a generic adjective unrelated to Roman Catholicism, meaning "all-embracing" or "universal". I was raised in a family of southern bigots on my father's side and fearful farmers on my mother's. There was no embracing anything in that family except white supremacy and durham wheat. My father's family were the rigid, by-the-book Catholics, although the book was not the Bible. We never did find what book it was; it was something they fabricated. So I have come a long way in over sixty years to overcome bias and prejudice and hatred and narrow-mindedness. So I am most interested in coming to understand your assertion that my being raised "catholic" explains anything about me.

Please. Take the podium. Because if you don't we will all know what you're made of.

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

Gunthar2000's picture

You are an idiot.

AA is a religious cult dressed up to look like a treatment for alcoholism.

Gunthar2000

http://www.expaa.org/

becket's picture

Interesting that you should consider a request for clarification and platform support "blather". Who's the true idiot in this picture, Gunthar-200?

“The essence of the independent mind lies not in what it thinks, but in how it thinks.”
― Christopher Hitchens, Letters to a Young Contrarian

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