12 stepping for the non-twelve stepper

I’m a huge fan of the 12-step program. I don’t care if you’re trying to overcome an addiction to food, drugs, porn or puppies.

I’ve read the Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous and I know all 12-steps in theory if not actually in practice.

You see, I’m not recovering from anything but plain old life. I’m a “cradle Christian”. In religious vernacular that means I’ve been going to church for my whole life—pretty much cradle to now and most likely, cradle to grave.

Man Arrested Before Going to AA Meeting for Voyeurism

AA Member Arrested For Voyeurism in Target Dressing Room Using His Cell Phone

PERKINS TOWNSHIP, Ohio — A female victim physically restrained a man who had been using his cell phone to videotape her as she changed in a Target dressing room, Fox 8 News reports.

According to a Perkins Township Police report, Zachary Ray Van Zandt, 21, of Sandusky, has been charged with voyeurism and disorderly conduct.

The real intent of AA’s “Suggested 12-Steps”

One of the first defenses that you will here when it comes to AA’s dogmatic 12 Step Religion is that it is not written in stone and that it is open for interpretation, that you can “take what you want and leave the rest”, that its steps are mere “suggestions” and that you need not follow them to the letter. Then they will tell you that AA does not claim to be the only solution or that it even advances the idea that only it has the answers. Those are all lies and in the final paragraph I’ll prove it. In the meantime, let me share with you what those 12 “suggestions” really imply….

Freedom of speech?

Imagine then a fleet or a ship in which there is a captain who is taller and stronger than any of the crew, but he is a little deaf and has a similar infirmity in sight, and his knowledge of navigation is not much better. The sailors are quarrelling with one another about the steering -- everyone is of opinion that he has a right to steer, though he has never learned the art of navigation and cannot tell who taught him or when he learned, and will further assert that it cannot be taught, and they are ready to cut in pieces anyone who says the contrary.

Al Gore/Sociology-Addictions

Between the most basic and primative prt of our brain ,responsible for bodily functiond and instinct
and the last structure within the brain to evolve,the part responsible for abstract thought and
known as the NEOCORTEX, is teh huge portion of our brain that governs emotion,called the LIMBIC SYSTEM.
In a very real sense ,the idea that human beings can function as disembodied intellects translates
into the absurd notion that the functions of the NEOCORTEX are the only workings of our brains
that matter. ...

Organisation of the Anti Stepper Movement

I think it is probably time the Anti Stepper Movement went up a gear and became more organised, J has recently posted about this movement needing organisation. Especially with recent events showing a certain amount of dissention in the ranks. I've spoke to Monica about the creation of an Anti Alcoholics Anonymous website or AAA. Rolf Ankermann has also suggested the very same idea.


How did an obvious religious (or satanic dependant on your point of view) cult, which was an off shoot of another cult know as the Oxford Group, with co -founders such as chain smoking, acid taking, conman and sexual predator Bill Wilson and child battering Bob Smith manage to so dominate the field of substance misuse? This cult apparently doesn't even work as an aid to a substance misuse problem, is full of mentally disturbed individuals, suicides, control freaks and sexual predators.

A professional GOT IT!

I have battled depression off and on since I was 12 and I am almost 50. I have been having some very low points lately and have been seeing my psychiatrist more to try to get my meds right. I saw her this morning and she completely got what I was saying about AA and 12-step. I had a feeling she understood before because she never called me on my complaints or tried to correct me on them. Today she acknowledged that she absolutely understood where I was coming from, wow, relief. She is fairly young, so more professionals might be catching on, or at least I hope so.

Noise Pollution

I guess adding the O’Jays doing “Backstabbers” was probably supposed to be witty, make a point, deliver a message or some other exceedingly clever thing, but being assaulted by it every time I open up this forum is just noise pollution to me.

Can’t Admin please kill the audio on that thing?

expressing upset personal feelings, does not make OPF "look bad"

in aa everybody walks around with fake smiles
repressing personal upset feelings
only takes their own inventory
anger is called a defect
etc et al

99.999% of the time
when someone says i wish you'd die
its not meant literally
its because they are so upset
that they are using wild words
which expresses deep upset feelings
and we've all said stuff like that

police officers call it jestering
and they won't press charges for it



Personal attacks on others are not allowed. == Orange

What is the first step to freedom from alcoholism?

Do I need to admit to myself that something is seriously wrong in my life? “Yes”
Do I need to admit to myself that I have created messes in my life? ‘Yes”
Is my whole life a mess, or maybe just important parts are a mess? “My whole life”
Can I admit this to myself? “Yes”
Can I stop playing the game alcoholic? “Yes”
Can I realize that my life has become unmanageable in many ways? “Yes”
Do I continue to do things that I later regret doing and tell myself that I will not do them again, but I do? “Yes”

US Law

Why do US Courts continue to mandate people to attend the off shoot of a 1930's cult? I don't know much about US Law but I've heard often that it is against your Law to force somebody into a religion, and AA has been declared a religion in some States (perhaps due tom the fact that God is mentioned 6 times in those 12 steps).

Why does this Court mandating to AA still occur in the US?

the public vs the private self vs the authemtic self

the public vs the private self


Came here a few times because I thought it would be a good place to "air my grievances". Finding out that people are splitting up over, well I don't know what.

Look, if you don't agree with something, and you wouldn't say what you're thinking about someone, to said someone offline....then take a walk, a break, or even a fucking drink! Anything that will postpone the blitz of crazy that this site has seen!

However, this may be the end result of something that was born out of trying to hurt something instead of healing something....

Back Stabbers

Who's staying?

A lot of people have left the OPF lately. I believe as Ben does, we continually need newly deprogramed people to contribute old and fresh ideas. But I don't believe other members need to leave just because of some on -line clash with another member of the forum.

Biologists Confirm God Evolved From Chimpanzee Deity

BERKELEY, CA—Challenging long-held views on the origins of divinity, biologists at the University of California, Berkeley, presented findings Thursday that confirm God, the Almighty Creator of the Universe, evolved from an ancient chimpanzee deity.

The recently discovered sacred ancestor, a divine chimp species scientists have named Pan sanctorum, reportedly gave rise over millions of years to the Lord Our God, Maker of Heaven and Earth.

Censorship, yet again

We are frequently told at stepper cult meetings that the program is infallible its the people who work it wrong. God will miracle a person to stop drinking (but NOT control drinking) if they work a strong program, do His will (?), attend stepper meetings regularly and recruit other vulnerable people into this 12 step thing.

"Adolescents can benefit from 12-step involvement"

John F. Kelly, Ph.D. , Mass. General Hospital

Adolescents can benefit from 12-step involvement

Why should I care? Because you should and besides, it’s good for you!

Some might counter and say what’s so important about empathy? I don’t really like people all that much and I prefer my own company anyway. While it’s true that our desire for or need to interact with other people varies a great deal from person to person, we were biologically designed as social creatures. I mean think about it, until the Petri dish arrived, the perpetuation of our species was only made possible by interaction. But I digress, sure there are people who are very happy being on their own, to a point. My dad was one of those kinds of people.

Is Alcoholics Anonymous a good "treatment" or "aftercare" that the US Courts system often coerces through sentencing? A case study of Shropshire, England.

We have all read about these incidents, an AA member leaves a meeting drunk and does something harmful. In the US this is very prevalent and it is often found out that the AA member in question was ordered to go to AA either directly through a "Drug" or "DUI" Court or by proxy through the ordering of a substance abuse evaluation as part of the sentencing in a regular (non-specific) court. In the UK, this is not done to a great extent, but people are trying to change that and people in the UK often try to emulate the AA get out of jail card that has become so prevalent in the US.

Maybe it's time for a bit of a change

It's been (another) rather hairy time on here for the last few days. I've tried, for the most part, to stay out of it, much to my own surprise as well as anyone else' There was a time when I would have been in the thick of it swinging with everyone else, but doing the same thing all the time gets a bit, well, boring.


The next comment will be no 100, Not bad in 3 years.

In the deep woods of Poland, Maine, an old warehouse in Bergen County, New Jersey and Santa Monica, California victims were brought into rooms to attend attack therapy to "help them." Now it is being done online where the cries for help can be heard.

I am of course talking about ELAN, Kids of New Jersey and SYNANON where people were brought into a room and the physical and mental attacking of the participants was encouraged by the facilitators of these meetings. In the deep woods of Poland, Maine, an old warehouse in Bergen County, New Jersey and Santa Monica, California victims were taught how to attack each other by action set up by Joe Ricci, Virgil Miller Newton or Charles E. "Chuck" Dederich. I have helped to expose and document these action.

Hit the Escape button Quick.

AA creates..

AA creates so called 'alcoholics' and kills drunks. That is all.

Oh, hello Gunthar.


Page NOT Redirection


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